The Hindu : 'India, Brazil, South Africa natural candidates for Security Council seat'

Online edition of India's National Newspaper
Wednesday, Oct 22, 2003

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'India, Brazil, South Africa natural candidates for Security Council seat'

By Amit Baruah

Celso Amorin

NEW DELHI OCT. 21. India, Brazil and South Africa are three "natural candidates" to enter the United Nations Security Council as permanent members, the Brazilian Foreign Minister, Celso Amorim, told The Hindu in an exclusive interview here.

The three countries, which formed a "trilateral commission" in June this year, working together would be important for reforming the Security Council itself, he said.

There were other candidates but as the new members would have to be developing countries, India, Brazil and South Africa were the "natural candidates" as they were three democracies with a reasonable degree of stability and internal harmony, Mr. Amorim said.

In the last three months, the Prime Minister, Atal Bihari Vajpayee, has met the Brazilian President, Lula da Silva, twice, and the South African President, Thabo Mbeki, twice. In New York last month, the three met together. Mr. Mbeki has just completed a tour of India, Mr. Lula da Silva will be the chief guest at the Republic Day celebrations here on January 26.

Asked what was behind the India-Brazil-South Africa (IBSA) Forum formed by the three countries in Brasilia, he said their "natural affinities" in the "multilateral field" indicated the path to be taken.

"It is the first case of systematically seeking tripartite cooperation between the countries of the South and I think it will be a very good example if it flourishes," he said pointing out that India, Brazil and South Africa were in the thick of trade liberalisation talks.

"South Africa is negotiating with India, India is negotiating with Brazil and Mercosur (the southern common market that also includes Argentina, Paraguay and Uruguay), Brazil and Mercosur are negotiating with South Africa. We have the potential for an expanded free trade area...," he said.

Why then had it taken the three countries so long to discover one another? "It's also due to the fact that our countries were very much immersed in regional politics... but the world has become so global that it is impossible to ignore the broader theme..."

On Iraq and the current mess, Mr. Amorim admitted that he "didn't know" how the country was to be rescued from its distress. "I think in a way it's good we have a new [Security Council] resolution because it gives legitimacy to the situation..."

"But I think it is still some way to go before we'll be able to solve the question. It's difficult to imagine how the situation will stabilise as long as there is no Iraqi Government that is seen as a legitimate representative of its people. The sooner we get to that the better."

Mr. Amorim said that his Government disagreed with the military attack on Iraq but it was concerned about terrorism in the new scenario.

"From what I know, the Saddam Hussein Government could be accused of many things... but it was not a hotbed for terrorism."

"Now, because of the lack of government, the lack of clear, legitimate authority, apparently, it is more prone to these things [terrorist acts] than it was before. So it's complicated. It has to do with the problem of the region as a whole. As long as you don't solve the problem of Palestine fully, it's difficult to solve other questions as well."

To a question on whether the developing countries' group could maintain its unity in the post-Cancun phase, Mr. Amorim said, "I think it will be able to keep its unity as long as it proves its utility. That's what it proved in Cancun... it was a pragmatic group, we were not ideologising the debate." China's entry into the group had been crucial.

Pleased at the purchase of five civilian Embraer aircraft by India from Brazil, Mr. Amorim said the two countries could also cooperate in the defence sector. Brazil could also offer India "patrol" aircraft. Bilateral trade was well over $1 billion and Brazil was aware of India's strength in the pharmaceutical industry.

On his President's "zero hunger" project launched after the January elections, Mr. Amorim said the main thrust was income support to poor families. It envisaged the use of magnetic cards to purchase food or other essential items.

Why was Brazil willing to acknowledge the problem of hunger when some other developing countries were not? "Our President went through this [in his] life. He believes that everyone has the right to have three meals in a day... Brazil [with 182 million people] is a land of contrasts, one of the largest producers of steel, fourth largest producer of commercial jets; at the same time we have to recognise that we have 30 to 40 million people living below the poverty line."

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