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‘We are not giving up on the arts’

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Martin Davidson: “It is about how we use the resources in the most effective way…

As Chief Executive of the British Council, Martin Davidson oversees its offices in 109 countries around the world. Under his stewardship, the Council has seen a reorientation in focus and the launch of new initiatives, particularly in Islamic countries. Excerpts from an interview:

The easy and simple answer is: no. But you would expect me to say that (laughs). Without making the answer too complicated, it is important to realise that the British Council has always seen culture in its widest sense. Cultural relations, which is what we do is about education, language, science, civil society…at the same time, I can’t conceive a cultural relations organisations that doesn’t have the arts at its very heart. It is a key component.

What we have to ask constantly though is how can we get the greatest impact. How can we build the greatest number of relationships? So I do think the emphasis on education and language is important. This is a response to what we hear from people in India about what they want. And what we hear from people in the U.K about how they want to develop a relationship with India.

Maybe, because we are focusing on these other things and because of what we say publicly, we have allowed people to think that the arts is no longer important to us. We are not giving up on the arts.

Is there much less? Or much less which has got the British Council logo on it? If we have allowed it to drop too far down on the priority list, then it is something we have to look at.

Our arts collaboration, for instance between India and the U.K., doesn’t have to be British Council. The way we look at arts will change in the future. For example, one of the things we have to do is provide information and support but not necessarily the funding to allow major British [arts] companies to tour.

The other side of course is the issue of libraries in Bhopal and in Trivandrum…I am sure you have [the question] on your list. (Laughs)

We always have to ask the question, ‘In a limited and constrained financial environment, what is the best way to use our resources to deliver the most effective set of relationships?’.

Take the case of Athens…as you know [the novelist] Fay Weldon ‘beat’ me up personally as being a philistine… (laughs). But what value were we delivering through that library? It would have been cheaper for us to give the books to the people who came to borrow them than run the library. The level was usage was so small in a city which is connected, has books, bookshops. The question was how we develop a better understanding of British literature in a country like Greece. Is it by running a library which hardly anybody uses? Or by doing something different?

Of course. We never ever take a decision of this kind lightly. If you work in the British Council, you are almost certainly steeped in the written word almost from birth. But we do have an obligation to ask the question, ‘Is spending the resources this way the most effective way of reaching a significant number of influential people? Or is there another way?’ To have made the Bhopal and Trivandrum libraries effective, we would have had to invest very large sums of money. The question was: is this the best way to have spent those resources? Or could we have impacted a larger number of people by using the resources a different way.

I absolutely reject the charge that Fay made that we are anti-book. I think that was a cheap shot to be honest. It is about how we use the resources in the most effective way…

It’s very early days. An analogy was used in a report we commissioned about six months ago…to try and see the impact of cultural relations is a bit like a forester going into a wood every day to see how much the trees have grown. You are talking about trying to measure on a daily basis something that is generational.

But to give you some examples of some of things I believe are important. Last week, we launched with al-Azhar university in Cairo a new programme on the development of the English language. The university is a major global source of religious teachers. For them to want to work with us on developing the English language and all the things that come with that -- access to international thinking, access to outside world – is significant.

The university was absolutely clear that it was looking for a wider environment for people going through it. I think it is an important project and will have an impact over time in an understanding of the wider external world among religious teachers. In Saudi Arabia, we have women’s centres directly involved in women’s education. In Pakistan…

I think that what’s vital here is that you are clear and honest about your motivations. And that you are clear and honest about the values you bring. You can’t have a conversation when one side is unsure where the other is coming from.

I think there is an important difference between public diplomacy and cultural relations. Public diplomacy is very much about pushing a message one way. Cultural relations is about creating an opportunity for dialogue. And what we are doing is to create an opportunity for dialogue. Cultural relations is not going to stop extremism. What it does is create a different sort of dynamic within which trust could be developed. We need to be careful about not overclaiming what can be achieved. But nonetheless, its impact is subtle and vitally important.

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