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Saturday, Jul 18, 2009
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Pakistan and the perils within

Pervez Musharrafsays the biggest threat to the country is extremism and terrorism by Taliban, Al-Qaeda, by the extremists in its society.

How does the former Pakistani General and President,Pervez Musharraf, view the state of Indo-Pakistan relations? Here are edited excerpts from an interview done in London by Karan Thapar for the programme “Devil’s Advocate,” being broadcast on CNN-IBN on July 18 and 19.

India-Pakistan relations have suffered in the wake of the terror attack in Mumbai. If you had been President, how would you have responded to Mumbai?

Well, certainly we would have cooperated in the investigation, because we wouldn’t like Pakistan to be blamed for being an accomplice — the government, or the Army, or the ISI… We would’ve joined the investigation and brought whoever has done it to book.

Why is Hafiz Saeed detained under the Maintenance of Public Order Act and not charged with terrorism?

I don’t know these legalities, frankly. I won’t be able to answer that.

If you were President and there was a shadow of doubt you would have charged him, wouldn’t you?

Certainly, [the] law has to be enforced.

Recently, President Zardari accepted that Pakistan had created and nurtured militant and extremist groups for short-term goals. The LeT and Jaish fall into that category, don’t they?

When we’re talking about all these organisations we have to go back about 20 years. We have to go back to 1989; we have to see what was happening in Kashmir and what happened in the decade of the 1990s. In the 1990s, the freedom struggle in Kashmir started and there were independent organisations in Pakistan which were fully supportive. That’s how all these organisations came into being and they had public sympathy, certainly in Pakistan. Now that the situation has changed and we’ve started a dialogue for the political settlement of Kashmir and all other disputes between India and Pakistan, we have to see what these independent groups are doing — these independent mercenary groups are doing. There is a shift in attitudes and now we’re here but the organisations you are talking of gained strength all along the 1990s.

Indian authorities say weeks after you stepped down as the army chief in November 2007 the peace along the LoC, which had prevailed from 2004, began to unravel. Isn’t this because the sort of people you had kept in check got a free hand when you stepped aside?

I really don’t know and won’t be able to comment on that, but certainly there was a policy we had formulated and that policy we were following strictly. I at least made sure that everyone down the ladder… must follow that policy in letter and spirit.

Is there a possibility that after you stepped down, others didn’t keep such a firm check and which is why activity which you clearly considered unacceptable began to resume?

I would say I had one advantage: I believed you ought to have unity of command if you want to effectively control and check such incidents or such activities. I had unity of command because I was the army commander and the President.

President Zardari told the Indian Prime Minister in June he had difficulty checking groups that were targeting India; he needed more time. What is the problem? Is President Zardari too weak for this task, or is [the task] too difficult or complicated?

The situation is extremely complex… There is a full-fledged war going on in Afghanistan and Mullah Omar with his Taliban [supporters] are fighting the coalition forces, the U.S. forces. Coming on to our side there is Al-Qaeda, which is active in Afghanistan as well as in Pakistan. We’ve to deal with them. Then there is Taliban — the Pakistani Taliban who are supported in Afghanistan. Afghan Taliban have links with them. The same Taliban are spreading Talibanisation in our settled districts. And the fourth element comprises the extremists in our society. The fifth element are the jehadis who want to go to Kashmir and fight. There is a nexus between all these and this nexus is extending its arms to a nexus of extremists in your society.

What is the possibility that it’s not the situation that has become more complex, but the willingness of your successors that is in question?

They suffer from one problem, certainly. As I said there has to be a unity of command between the federal government, the army and the provincial government — the frontier provincial government especially. That unity of command that existed when I was there...

At least twice in the last three months President Zardari has said Pakistan doesn’t see India as a military threat. Do you agree with him?

India has certain forces, those forces are deployed in certain ways and they’ve certain plans. But obviously at this moment there’s no war scenario and there’re no threats... But after the Bombay incident all your politicians, your media were talking of punishing Pakistan — talking of hot pursuit action and surgical strikes. So when that happens certainly there is a threat from Indian forces.

Are Pakistanis today less wary of India and more willing to believe that India means them no harm?

I think generally, if you took my view, most of them think India has not reconciled to Pakistan’s existence and therefore there’s always a threat from India.

Today the real enemy Pakistan faces is extremism within?

Yes, indeed. But having said that if there are threatening noises coming from the Indian side then one has to again see. Threat perception [assessment] has to be carried out very regularly and it’s done by the army. At this moment you are absolutely correct, but I only hope no politician in India again starts to make aggressive sounds: let’s go and punish Pakistan, let’s go and carry a….

But General Musharraf, give me a clear answer. Today which is the bigger threat?

Today under the absolute present circumstances — today — the biggest threat is extremism and terrorism by Taliban, Al-Qaeda, by the extremists in our society.

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